The Camino de Santiago is one of the most famous treks in the world. In this episode, Victor Prince joins us to share the practical & spiritual realities behind such a long-term trekking journey
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This trek is simply legendary. And I’ve met so many people who’ve spent a month on it and all of them agree: It’s pretty amazing. By the end, it’s like you’ve transformed yourself into another period of life. It’s definitely something I’ll do — hopefully sooner than later.
Of all the people I’ve spoken with about this trek, none are as much of an expert as Victor Prince. He’s written a book about the Camino de Santiago, and done it five times already! So here are some details about what makes the trek so special and also how to prepare for it — physically and mentally. Hopefully, we’ll catch you on the road soon!
Q: How did you even create this incredible connection that you’ve got with the Camino de Santiago?
About about eight years ago, I was taking a sabbatical my career, and I took six months off… And I wanted to do a hike for a month. And when you look around trails in the world, one of the few trails in the world where you can hike for a month without having to camp is the Camino Santiago, which goes across Spain.
So I decide to hike that trail and then the experience was so life-changing that it got me it it gave me the confidence to start writing books and to launch my own business and corporate training and coaching.
I then wrote a blog about my experience on the Camino and that blog went viral on LinkedIn. It was at the top of LinkedIn for about a week and it snowballed into a book deal with Harper Collins. And now the book is out in the English, Spanish, Chinese, and it’s in libraries all over the world.
And I’ve done I’ve done a Camino talk in about twenty-seven cities around the world on the book tour. So I love talking about the Camino: I’ve gone back and hiked it five times since because it’s just such a it’s a wonderful experience.
Q: What does everyone need to know about the Camino de Santiago?
I’ll give you a quick overview of what it is and then I’ll give you I’ll give you a thousand years of history in about about two minutes.
The trail itself is it’s actually a network of trails across Spain. And they all end up in the same point, which is a city in the northwest corner of Spain called Santiago de Compostela. So basically, if you walk from anywhere in Europe and you walk toward Santiago de Compostela, you’ll probably hit a Camino path… Because people have been doing this trail for thousands of years.
Most of the time when people say they’re doing the Camino, about half of them are doing the Camino Frances, which is one that goes from just over the Pyrenees in a little village called Sinjar. That one goes to Pamplona, to Logrono, Burgos, Leon, and then Santiago. So it kind of does a little arc across the northern part of Spain. And if you do that whole trail, it takes about thirty-two days of 15 miles/25 kilometers a day.
A lot of people do the whole thing. Some people just do a week or two at a time. But that’s what the trail is. And there’s other trails as well. But that’s the most popular one.
And the trail actually started about a thousand years ago around like 830 AD. Back then, a priest in a little village in the northwest corner of Spain had reports of noises and lights outside of his church. So he went to investigate it up in the hills and found a grave. And he declared that grave to contain the remains of St. James, one of the disciples of Jesus.
St. James in Spanish is San Diego. So the priest built a little shrine. The shrine became a church, and the church eventually became a huge cathedral in a city of about one hundred thousand people. And so after the shrine was built, people started to walk to see it. And then in the year 950 AD, a pilgrim was recorded as coming all the way from Les Quis, France, about eight hundred kilometers away.
And by doing so, he was the first peregrino, or pilgrim, on the Camino de Santiago or the way to Santiago.
So after after that pilgrim came, more people did it. And then in the year 1140 AD, a book came out about the Camino. It was in Latin and it was mostly about the miracles of St. James. But the last chapter was specifically about the logistics of doing a Camino to get to Santiago. So in many ways, it was the first tour guide in the world. And after the book came out, the Camino really exploded in the 1200’s, 1300’s, and 1400’s.
That’s probably when the Camino maxed out. We don’t have we don’t have specific numbers, but we do have records of, for example, in one hostel along the way in the 1600’s, over 16,000 people stayed when they were walking on the Camino. So we know that tens of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of people were doing the Camino, even even in medieval ages. After the Reformation, the Camino started to dwindle, but people always did it.
But by 1979, there were only seventy pilgrims recorded in the community of Santiago. But then in 1985, a book came out. It started getting popular again. And then in 2010, a movie came out called The Way with Martin Sheen and Emilio Estevez. And that started making it popular with Americans and Canadians and others.
So in 2019, over 320,000 people did the Camino, meaning they did at least 100 kilometers on foot or 200 kilometers on bike.
And that’s that’s the Camino in a nutshell.
Is the Camino special because of what it is? Or is it special because of the narrative around it?
I think it’s a combination. Historically, for a thousand years, people have been walking this trail and a lot of people do it for the adventure. Maybe they want a break in their lives or get over some sorrows. So that’s what’s neat about that, it ties you together with a thousand years of humans who kind of had the same experience you’re having because walking hasn’t really changed that much.
And then I think the the more specific thing that makes this trail unique… I’ve done trails in a dozen countries around the world. But this trail, it combines two unique pieces: You get this great alone time where you’re walking through the countryside in these remote villages. So you get a lot of time for self reflection. But you also get this great social piece because people from all over the world are doing the Camino. And it’s very easy to connect with other pilgrims because you’re sharing the same experience.
And if you start on a certain day, you kind of end up probably walking in the same stage as each day with people. So you can really get to know people from all over the world. After you walk the Camino, you get this sort of Camino family. And these are friends that are all over the world because people from all over the world do the Camino.
That’s that’s what I think is really the special sauce about the Camino that makes it different than any other trail that I’ve been on.
Q: What’s the “infrastructure” on the Camino? You don’t need to really bring much, right?
Yeah, you’re right. The Camino is so old — a thousand years old. That villages actually sprouted up along the Camino to support pilgrims.
So they would have restaurants. And there are hostels called albergues. These are hostels that are specifically for people walking the Camino and they’re low-cost and they. And that’s really what got me into the Camino: I was too lazy to camp. Here, you don’t have to carry a tent.
You also don’t have to carry tons of water and food. It’s very different than trails like the Appalachian Trail here in the United States, where that’s kind of a roughing-it experience. Versus the Camino, where you can basically stay under a roof every night. In fact, there’s companies that will carry your bags for you if you want.
Q: Do you see this as a common thread: That people on the Camino are at a point of change in their life?
Yeah, people do the Camino for all different reasons. In fact, if you finish up in Santiago, you get the Compostela certificate, which is this document in Latin that says you did it. And then they ask you why you did it. I think about 40 percent of people say they do it for religious reasons. Maybe another 40 do it for just kind of spiritual reasons. And then maybe 20 percent do it just because it’s a it’s a good adventure.
So everyone has different reasons. But I think there is a common thread that’s tied people together for a thousand years: It is a great way to put something in your past or set a break in life.
And in fact, on the highest point on the Camino, there’s a cross called the Cruz de Ferro (Iron Cross). And the tradition is that pilgrims, when they start, they put a little stone in their pocket, and when they get to the Cruz, they deposit the stone and say a prayer or make a goal.
But over a thousand years that that pile has become like a hill of stones all around it, which is kind of a big thing. So for me, it was a chance to take a break in my career because I’d been in these high-pressure political jobs in Washington, D.C. for the previous several years.
So it was a chance for me to decompress. And one other thing the Camino did for me washelp me quit my addiction to nicotine. I used to chew tobacco, but while doing the Camino, I made a goal to myself to stop. And in eight years since, I haven’t touched it again.
Q: Do you see any similarities between the Camino de Santiago and Burning Man? Two unique experiences with people returning year after year?
Yeah, I could see it. In the sense of people crossing with people.
But I think the audiences that do the Camino are pretty different. I haven’t been to Burning Man, but on the Camino of all ages. In fact, you see a lot of folks who are retired, you see a lot of teachers because they have a longer break and all that.
You do have those wanderlusters who just like to travel — maybe they’re the ones attracted to Burning Man as well.
But it’s neat. You get people of all ages and from all countries. So it’s different that way. But I think some 15 percent of people are supposed to have this wanderlust gene which just makes you want to move and travel. So both events probably attract those people.
Q: What makes your specific connection to this place so special? What keeps drawing you back?
Yeah, I think it’s two reasons.
The first is there are many different paths that are on the Camino. So if you do the French way, it’s the most common one. About half the people do that.
But then I’ve gone back and I’ve done the Portuguese way, which is basically a path that goes straight up through Portugal to Santiago de Compostela.
I’ve done the English way, which is a shorter path that comes in from the north, a little bit north and east of Santiago. And that’s like a five day path.
And then I’ve done Camino Finisterra, which is about three to five days after to the west of Santiago. It goes all the way to the ocean and Finisterra, which the Europeans thought was the end of the earth back in the 1400s. So the first reason is that there’s a lot of different trails you can do.
That said, I keep going back to the French way for the second reason, which is that every time you walk, you’re walking with different people.
That’s a big part of the Camino: the social experience. Meeting all these people from all over the world and sharing this intense experience with them while long-term trekking. You just you build these friendships and you build a sense of community. So every time I go back, it’s with different people.
And now often I’ll have a personal mission to help people do the Camino. So I’ll even have people go with me so I can encourage them and walk with them to help them, you know, feel like they can do it.
Q: Is there a Camino mindset that’s different from your normal mindset?
Yeah definitely. One great thing about the Camino is that it’s hard work. You’re walking 15 miles, 25 kilometers a day, but you’ve got all day to do it. And most of the time you’re spending in countryside.
So you have a lot of time to reflect, and you’re also not answering your cell phone all the time. You have a very simple life where your whole goal each day is just to get to the next point. And then you have you have your meal with other pilgrims. And then everything’s very simple: In your backpack, you’re carrying everything you need.
And most people just have like maybe two or three changes of clothes. You get to the next hospital and you wash your clothes at night. Every pilgrim kind of looks the same. You know, it’s not about the car you drive or what clothes you’re wearing. Everyone’s kind of broken down to this bare existence.
So it makes life simple and you’re just walking and following the arrows to the next place. It really issuch a relaxing experience that way, even though it is a physical challenge. But it’s mentally relaxing in many ways.
Q: What is that bond like between the people on the Camino?
It depends a little bit on which trail you take and when you go. So if you’re on the French way at any time except the dead of winter, there’s going to be other pilgrims on that trail. And you’ll be staying in probably the same hostels as them along the way.
And then one of the rules that pilgrims are asked to live by on the Camino’s is make others feel welcome. So between pilgrims we help each other out. Plus, the villagers support pilgrims because not only do they support the history and mission of the Camino but also their local economies rely on it.
So you feel very welcome when you’re on the Camino. On one of the trails that aren’t so busy, you might go hours without seeing another pilgrim. But you’ll usually connect with pilgrims at night when you start the hostels.
For me personally, I’ve made friends on the Camino that I’ve later visited in California and England and Ireland and Canada. So you get you get this network and you connect with them on social networks. And the best part, I met my girlfriend on the Camino eight years ago — what’s crazy is I live in the US and she lives in Sweden.
What other long-term treks from around the world would you recommend?
So in the US, what you’ve got is the Appalachian Trail and the Pacific Crest Trail and the great Continental Divide Trail. Those are all very long trails. But those are ones where you have to camp and carry all your food and water and you’re sleeping in a tent every night.
To put in perspective, 300,000+ people do the Camino every year and about 1,000 people do the Appalachian Trail. So it’s a very different experience for those trails in the US. But we are getting more now that there’s a lot of biking trails emerging. So I’ve done a bunch of trails in the US like that.
In Europe, after the Camino, another big one is the Via Francigena — basically stretching from Canterbury in England all the way down to Rome. It’s not as busy as the Camino but it’s there as well.
And the place where I actually got hooked on walking was in London — I was working there for six months a bunch of years ago. On the weekends I used to go and do these ” rambles.” So you take the train maybe an hour outside of London and then you walk from one little village to another. It’s all these medieval footpaths… And the deal is as long as someone walks it every year, they have to keep it open to the public.
There’s also this great trail in Ireland called the carriageway. I’ve done that one as well. And then one of the coolest trails I did recently was part of the book tour for the Camino. There was this mother and daughter who did the Camino in Spain and they were from South Africa. They wanted to to create an experience like that for their for their fellow countrymen and women in South Africa. So they created something called the Cape Camino down in Cape Town.
They basically pieced together a circular route around Cape Town that combines kind of some of the spiritual sites there. And it’s a super wonderful hike that my girlfriend and I did a few years ago.
So there’s places all over. In fact, ther was someone from South Korea who hiked the Camino — they went back and was so passionate about it. They created a trail on an island in South Korea called Jeju Olle.
And really, yu’re seeing a lot of this: People hike the Camino and get inspired to “make one” back home.
Q: How do people handle personal attachments in relation to a big trip like this?
A lot of people can’t take a month off because they have jobs or responsibilities and all that. But you don’t have to do the whole month of the Camino. So a lot of people do it kind of one or two weeks at a time. And I really recommend to try to get try to at least 10 days to two weeks, because that way you’ll get lost in the experience. You’ll feel way more connected.
What I love is how the Camino disconnects you from your cell phone and work. If you’re there two weeks, that’s a lot of time that you’re not worrying about what’s back home.
But also: If you do care about finishing in Santiago de Compostela and getting the certificate, you have to start at least 100km before the finish line.
And that’s actually where the trail gets busier, because you get tour groups and others joining. But if you just want a good scenic section, I recommend those first two weeks of the Camino Frances over the Pyrenees and through wine country.
Q: Regarding logistics (timing, athleticism, expenses), what’s the best time to embark on such long-term trekking?
For starters, you don’t have to be in really good shape to do it. You just have to be able to wak. If you can walk a mile, you can probably walk ten miles.
You just have to make sure you have good shoes and basic equipment.
The big thing I recommend is to make sure you do it while you can still walk that much. Put a date on it to make sure you get it off your bucket list while you’re still able.
Also, I’d say to avoid the December, January, February time frame because the weather might be subpar and some hostels may be closed. I’d also avoid September and August just because they’re the busiest months (and the hostels are most likely to be full).
October’s a great time from both a crowd and weather standpoint. And this advice applies for all the different trails.
And one other barrier that people have is being hesitant about the hostels along the way. Yeah, they have shared rooms — some with a bunch of strangers. But I tell people: It’s a very different experience from hostels you may have seen while backpacking as a college kid. Everyone here is a pilgrim, mostly adults, so it’s a different experience.
But if that’s not your thing, there are also plenty of private rooms along the way that you can book.
When it comes to expenses — apart from getting to Spain — it can actually be a very economical trip. Because if you do stay in these hostels, they’re made to help out pilgrims on a budget. The beds can be even 5 euros a night — 15 or 20 euros is the more expensive side. Some that are run by nuns can even let you stay for free if that’s what you need.
So that gets you a bed for a night. And then there are restaurants along the way. Typically they have a discount menu for pilgrims with a starter (i.e. chicken) and rice with a desert. Plus you can get a bottle of wine for like 10 euros.
Q: It seems like your book is a good place to start for those interested — what can we expect in there?
Yeah so it’s not a travel guide — no maps or anything like that.
It’s mostly sharing my stories and lessons learned. And I interviewed over 100 pilgrims from 16 countries to add wonderful communal stories.
Basically: My book is about the experience of the Camino — perfect for those who haven’t walked the Camino yet… And for those who may never get out there. At the very least, they can still benefit from the lessons of the journey.
But if you do want a tactical resource that dives into budgeting and all that, most countries with lots of pilgrims usually have a nonprofit organization that can help. In the U.S., it’s called the American Pilgrims on the Camino.
What they do is issue a credential that identifies you as a pilgrim. This lets you stay in hostels that are pilgrim-only and collect stamps to prove your progress to get that certificate at the end. And just in general, they have all sorts of information about what to bring and how to prepare.
Final Q: What is your main mission here?
It’s to help others experience this community. I love helping people out — not only answering questions but also giving people the confidence to do it. So I love doing interviews like this.
And last thing: I have all kinda of great pictures and videos from the trek. People can go to my website or check it out on Facebook. And hopefully I’ll see you out there soon!
